Post 4QLPpk695ET

Fiona Jallings Jul 31, 2014 (06:35)

I was looking for a word for "hearth", and found the Quenya word "ruimen". Then I looked it up in its context, and found the untranslated Sindarin word "ruist" beside it. On the other side is the Quenya words for "wildfire". I think that "ruist" means "hearth". The history would look like this: RUYU+SAT>ruisat>ruista>ruist. Do you guys think that's plausible?

Tamas Ferencz Jul 31, 2014 (12:13)

ruimen is transparently fire + place, so supplementing men (which is not found in S?) would make sense, but isn't that rather sad as is Calenhad?

Roman Rausch Aug 01, 2014 (00:09)

There is the sundóma suppression rule, in particular when the base vowel is prefixed (VT47:13). It produces CE forms like ap'lata > ablad (PAL-), aklar > aglar/alkar (KAL-, for some reason no apostrophe) or as'tāra > astar/astor (PE17:183).
Perhaps it applies to compounds as well, so we would have *ruys'ta > ruist.

Calenhad is a much later compound - it has to be, because of lenition instead of nasal mutation.

Fiona Jallings Aug 01, 2014 (16:53)

This would imply that "ruist" would be a very old compound. Alright, I'm adding it to the Neo-Sindarin list. Not exactly a coined word, but it is slightly shaky as in it's an assigned meaning.

Roman Rausch Aug 01, 2014 (19:45)

How is it an assigned meaning? The translation 'fireplace, hearth' is right there.. An unclear etymology doesn't make a word Neo-, otherwise much (most?) of English would be Neo-English. :-)

Fiona Jallings Aug 02, 2014 (03:45)

It's not given in any Sindarin dictionaries anywhere else, so Neo-Sindarin users without access to PE17 would otherwise not know about the word. I only found it because I went looking to reconstruct it, because it seemed that Sindarin didn't have a word for it. I don't have any dictionary websites l that I maintain other than contributing to this one, so I put it out there in a place I could reach.

Lőrinczi Gábor Aug 02, 2014 (11:56)

+Fiona Jallings "It's not given in any Sindarin dictionaries anywhere else, so Neo-Sindarin users without access to PE17 would otherwise not know about the word."

Except for German and Hungarian users, since ruist is given as an attested word both in "Sindarin Lexikon" and in my dictionary. :)

Fiona Jallings Aug 03, 2014 (06:09)

Ah, should have specified: it's missing from English-Sindarin dictionaries. Unfortunately, I speak neither German nor Hungarian...

Matt Dinse Aug 03, 2014 (22:04)

It's in David Giraudeau's PE17 Sindarin wordlist, though he doesn't gloss it.

Fiona Jallings Aug 04, 2014 (04:12)

Yup. That's the problem.