Post 66JdYq37LHe

Tamas Ferencz May 19, 2014 (16:15)

How would you guys say 'pass time, spend time' in Quenya?

Tamas Ferencz May 19, 2014 (17:07)

+Kevin B Walsh
actually, mar- is a good idea, thanks for reminding me of it!

ܤܡܝ ܦܠܕܢܝܘܤ May 19, 2014 (19:55)

I wonder if *lúmesta- could be used to cover the verb, & noun part also (idiomatically), given there was koiresta- "spend one's life" back in Qenya (PE12:48), from Qe koirë "life" (LT1:257).

Semantically Finnish kuluttaa parallels both Latin consumere and Hebrew billah (all are used for "spend [+time]"); yet should one simply glue together Q ó-/o- (or some other prefixable) and map(a)– and imagine having gotten somewhere? (Obviously, there exists the authentic Q form Vása "Consumer"... but what is its root?). A prefixed anta- (e.g. *hóanta-?) might be a better idea, cp. Latin dedere, tradere "devote [things, attention]", ~ even unprefixed Qe toqo- > (adapted) !toqu- "yield, give, bear, bring forth" (after Russian про-водить, -вести, Norwegian til-bringe, etc.).

Then again, *yuhta- ("use") and sat- also seem like options to think about.

Tamas Ferencz May 20, 2014 (10:41)

+ܤܡܝ ܦܠܕܢܝܘܤ
*ómapa as in carpe diem?
*lúmesta is an appealing possibility, I just think that sta is already a bit overloaded (granted, many other suffixes are); but the attested koiresta-, as you say, is a strong argument.
I wonder if toqo- was that which eventually evolved into TUK-, or are the two unrelated.

In Hungarian, BTW, we 'fill' (tölt) the time that we spend - another idiom that could be used as a model!

Vása - I admit I've never given that word a thought to date; something to think about!

Thanks, Sami!

Ицхак Пензев May 20, 2014 (14:01)

I would suggest to consider something based on the notion "activity". We find vecca and vehtë in PE17. Návë vecca sound not as lofty as mar-, IMHO.

Tamas Ferencz May 20, 2014 (14:43)

+Ицхак Пензев
maybe, but to translate 'I will spend five days in Alqualonde" using what you suggest does not look so simple; unless we assume there is a related verb *vehta- 'be active, spend time, live [for a time]'? (Which would not be such a bad idea TBH).

Ицхак Пензев May 20, 2014 (14:44)

+Tamas Ferencz
*Vehta- That's exactly what I was hinting at!

Tamas Ferencz May 20, 2014 (14:49)

ܤܡܝ ܦܠܕܢܝܘܤ May 20, 2014 (16:36)

Opting for mar- when there's a place included would resemble the use in Icelandic of dvelja (1, stay, remain, dwell) : hún dvaldi viku á fjöllum = "she spent a week in [the] mountains".

Tamas Ferencz May 20, 2014 (16:46)

+ܤܡܝ ܦܠܕܢܝܘܤ
I presume dvelja is a cognate of English dwell?

Ицхак Пензев May 20, 2014 (17:08)

I don't understand why we should we search for examples in foreign languages instead of studying the internal logic of Quenya.

Tamas Ferencz May 20, 2014 (23:26)

+Ицхак Пензев looking at the problem from different angles might enlighten us how natural languages solve this semantic task which then may give us useful parallels we can employ. Also, because it's fun:)

Ицхак Пензев May 21, 2014 (10:26)

I agree 100%, Tamas. I only insist that it should not be the last argument :)