G+ LoME Archive
Sep 20, 2017 (10:07)
Tell me about your workaround solutions for the conjunction 'so that/in order to/
'. Or maybe there is something attested? I think this is physically the second most important clause connector after the relative pronoun and needed almost always.
Sep 20, 2017 (11:34)
That is not an easy question and i do not have a definite answer; lacking a specific attestation I would say you can may be playing with workarounds using
- a gerund in dative as in
- the particular infinitive with or without a pronominal suffix
- a future imperfect participle with or without a pronominal suffix
Sep 20, 2017 (11:38)
Dative gerund, I guess? Depends on the context. A probable construction ought to be
comyan ondor carien coanya
"I gather stones for the building of my home".
Also, G+ so is not optimised for the iPhone. I kept submitting my post too early!
Sep 20, 2017 (11:50)
conj. “that which, what”, and
, adv. “in that case” (PE22)
where the latter appears to be a short locative of the former; therefore I propose that
, a dative form of
would be a viable choice for "so that, in order"
Sep 20, 2017 (19:34)
As far as Sindarin goes, I'd say we're rather lucky to have STEL /
(WJ:318-9) from which to derive e.g.
(+the desired action in the infinitive), or *
(> preposition + said noun +
Sep 22, 2017 (12:36)
. Though I would use gerunds after it, rather than infinitives, and with lenition:
Dagron, thíliel naged yrch.
[I battle, having intended slaying orcs.]
Sep 22, 2017 (13:03)
why gerund? Here the second verb is the object of thílilel, I think an infinitive is appropriate?
Sep 22, 2017 (13:27)
I'm influenced by "aníra suilannad/tírad" examples. Although they don't show lenition. Then "thíliel daged" may be better.
Sep 22, 2017 (13:29)
Why do we have infinitives as objects separate from gerunds? Per LVS, that's Noldorin, not Sindarin.
Sep 22, 2017 (13:43)
Okay, okay, I was influenced by Quenya it appears. Gerund it is then:)
Sep 22, 2017 (14:14)
Continuing with the Sindarin expressions: I just realised that given the model
< MEL, the handily short *
might also be a valid abstract noun derivation from STEL. (And due to similarity with the stock of THIL, its use might imaginably indeed be stricter or even limited to certain expressions..)
Sep 24, 2017 (08:48)
Somehow I forgot about
an edraith ammen
. Now I think that just an abstract now sent to dative is a good choice.
Sep 26, 2017 (09:49)
I wanted to add that in Quenya there is also the adverb
which could also be used in sentences like "I came home so that ['and in that way'] you can leave"
túlen mardenna tanen eke tyen auta