Post RNMbXwLfhCj

Paul Strack Sep 06, 2018 (04:16)

I've released v.0.6.8 of Eldamo:

With this release, I have finished a "first pass" at evaluating attested primitive roots for inclusion/exclusion in my dialect of Neo-Eldarin. I produced a whole bunch of neologisms in the process. This was mainly an exercise in figuring out my style of neologism creation and getting comfortable with the process, although as with most thing in Tolkien linguistics, it took much, much longer than I anticipated.

As I mentioned in my last post, now that I am comfortable with the scope of my own neologism creation, I am ready to incorporate neologisms from other people into Eldamo. I've decided to be very inclusive, and add neologisms to Eldamo even I myself wouldn't use them, provided they are of a reasonable quality. In fact, I've already included a few such words.

If you have a neologisms you want me to add to Eldamo, let me know. The bar is not very high. You only need to convince that the would could conceivably be part of Neo-Eldarin; you don't have to convince me that its a word that I myself should use. In other words, it should fit the phonetic structure of the given language (Quenya or Sindarin) and should be justified in some way by existing forms (or be a good loan word from a real-world language), but otherwise more or less anything is fair game.

At some point in the future I may pare the list down to "accepted" and "rejected" neologisms, and I still have some vague hopes for some community-driven process for evaluating neologisms. I also reserve the right to offer alternatives and open things up to community debate. Sometimes (though not always) such discussions can result in some kind of general consensus on the "right" word, and when they do I find the resulting neologism tends to be of higher quality.

The best way to offer up proposed neologisms is here on the Discord server. You don't need to specifically mention me; I intend to keep an eye on future neologism discussions and add interesting neologisms to Eldamo once any "debate" has settled down.
Eldamo : Home
Eldamo - An Elvish Lexicon. by Paul Strack — v0.6.8 — generated September 5, 2018. Languages · References. Word Searches: Neo-Eldarin Word Search · Academic Word Search · International Searches. This collection of documents is a lexicon of Tolkien's invented languages, particularly his Elvish ...

Paul Strack Sep 06, 2018 (05:49)

After posting the above, I’m a bit worried that some of the things I said might give the wrong impression. When I said “I will include neologisms that I would not use myself”, I’m afraid people might think that what I meant was “I will include your neologisms even if I think they’re garbage”.

What I really meant was this:

There are a large variety of possible “styles” of creating neologisms. Most of the neologisms in Eldamo right now fit my style, because they were mostly created by me. But my style is not the only way to go about creating neologisms, and is not necessarily better than the style and approach others might take.

What I want to do is include “good” neologisms that are created using a different style or set of priorities than my own. While I have my own preferences, other approaches are equally legitimate. If someone makes a neologism of a different “style” than my own, I’d still like to add such neologisms to Eldamo.

My hope is, at some point in future, that we will be able to establish some sort of community rating system for neologisms so that we reach some consensus on vocabulary. Until then, I think it’s better to include a larger variety of neologisms in various styles, so that individuals can choose among them.

Tamas Ferencz Sep 06, 2018 (08:59)

You talk about offering you new words on Discord - is this a cross-post?
I use Discord mainly to chat - I find it less comfortable for discussions about grammar or dissecting translations or collecting neologisms, so for that I'll mostly remain here.

Lokyt L. Sep 06, 2018 (09:20)

I suppose the answer is negative (and maybe I'm not the first one to ask this), but still: Is there a way to display Eldamo without the neologisms?
(I would definitely appreciate that - the neologisms are getting numerous and filtering them out in one's mind only is getting more and more difficult while working with the database...)

Tamas Ferencz Sep 06, 2018 (09:48)

+Lokyt L. There's an "Academic Word-Search" and a "Neo-Eldarin Word Search" link on the main page of Eldamo.

Lokyt L. Sep 06, 2018 (10:09)

+Tamas Ferencz The academic search returns neologisms as well.

(But the search engine is not a problem. The trouble comes while browsing within entries.)

Tamas Ferencz Sep 06, 2018 (10:23)

+Lokyt L. indeed it does - apologies then, it may then be an unintended feature

Paul Strack Sep 06, 2018 (11:12)

+Tamas Ferencz You can offer neologisms both here and on Discord, where ever you are more comfortable. This is indeed a cross post.

Paul Strack Sep 06, 2018 (11:15)

+Lokyt L. The “academic mode” is supposed to be neologism free, but right now they can “bleed through” indirectly through links. For example, roots list both attested words and neologisms as derivatives.

I will look into to cleaning things up, so that academic mode is more “pure” and doesn’t show neologisms even as links.

Tamas Ferencz Sep 06, 2018 (11:41)

+Paul Strack great:)

Lokyt L. Sep 06, 2018 (12:03)

+Paul Strack Thank you, that would be wonderful!

Paul Strack Sep 07, 2018 (05:28)

+Lokyt L. I filed a bug against Eldamo for “academic mode” cleanup so the issue doesn’t get lost:

I can’t promise when I will get to this, but Eldamo’s value as a pure research tool is pretty important to me, so I will tackle this eventually.

Lokyt L. Sep 12, 2018 (00:26)

A little more bothering, +Paul Strack:
I found a section in PE 13 that is missing in Eldamo. On p. 124, after the end of the second table (i.e. after tanc - tainc), everything from i weg mór to i ngwaig nuilch seems to have been omitted.
(Including one of rare examples of modified adjective in N./S., by the way ;))

Paul Strack Sep 12, 2018 (01:00)

+Lokyt L. It’s certainly possible I’ve missed something. I will take a look.

Paul Strack Sep 12, 2018 (01:04)

Erg, I see what happened. I copied the phrases, but didn’t decompose them into individual words. I will fix it.

Paul Strack Sep 12, 2018 (01:07)

See here:

The phrase is in Eldamo, but not broken into words.

Lokyt L. Sep 12, 2018 (01:39)

Ah, OK :) Thanks again.

Lokyt L. Sep 18, 2018 (11:39)

+Paul Strack One more piece: Eldamo gives Q. otwe (, while QL/71 has otwen (with -n).

Paul Strack Sep 18, 2018 (20:24)

+Lokyt L. thank you, I’ve corrected it for the next release