G+ LoME Archive
Post cj1UgBEX4so
Hjalmar Holm, Paul Strack, WordWheel, Jenna Carpenter

Hjalmar Holm Mar 08, 2015 (21:16)

I tried to make a word for "sap, resin" with the root KHIM (the thought being of vaurse that sap and resin is sticky and viscous) and the suffix -la. My thought was to liken it with hîw and haew with the same roots but a different suffixes (I guess on -ma and -ja, but I am not sure).

Using Salo's Gateway: Khimla --> ximla --> xemla --> xeml --> xevl --> hevl --> hewl (to this point I really think I have done it right) --> hewol or perhaps heiwl? Ithink something went wrong at the end.

Jenna Carpenter Mar 08, 2015 (22:36)

Given the etymology of 'juice, fluid (from a tree)', I wouldn't create a word, I'd use a circumlocution: saw/paich en-orn

Paul Strack Mar 08, 2015 (23:36)

I think hevl > hevol. I think v became w only at the end of a morpheme boundary, and only after a high vowel (i, y or u), see A Gateway to Sindarin (GS:61 §4.173). Also compare celefn > celevon, where the [-evn] > [-evon] (Etym:KYELEP).

Personally, though, I would Sindarize one of the attested Gnomish words for "resin": G thugli or G thuith (GL:73). In QL, the root is given as SUKU (QL:86), but the Gnomish cognates point to ÞUK (THUK), a root that Tolkien did not reuse in his later writings as far as I know.

I admit my knowledge of Gnomish and Early Qenya phonology is almost non-existent, but I am pretty sure G thuith is a cognate of EQ sukte, pointing to a primitive form of *þuktē (thuktē). In later Sindarin phonology, I think the form produced would also be S thuith (GS:46 §4.91).

Hjalmar Holm Mar 09, 2015 (13:42)

I have never seen the translation "fluid from tree" of either saw or paich, but I am now convinced to user one of them for sap from some broadleaves, such as maple and birch, from whose one actually produce juice and sirup. Resin, though, perhaps what Paul proposed with thuith. I have also very limited knowledge in gnomish.

Jenna Carpenter Mar 09, 2015 (13:43)

Eh that's not what I said, by etymology I meant of the English word 'sap' :-)
Hence I'd use saw - juice or paich - syrup, juice.

Hjalmar Holm Mar 11, 2015 (12:31)

All right, I misunderstood you Jenna. I thought you were talking about the etymology of one of the elvish words.