G+ LoME Archive
Sep 23, 2017 (00:37)
Would saveryet translate to he believes it?
Sep 23, 2017 (00:56)
Rather he believes them.
Sep 23, 2017 (01:17)
I would read it that way, yes. It is subtle, though. The phrase more accurately means "He believes they exist". To mean something like "He believes what they say", the proper phrase would be:
"(lit.) He believes their words"
Sep 23, 2017 (01:23)
The best translation of
would be "I believe in Elves", that is that Elves exist. To translate "I believe the Elves", that is that what they say is true, the construct is as above:
saven i Eldaron quetier
"I believe in the words (or sayings) of the Elves"
Sep 23, 2017 (09:20)
Hm. I wish to add no-one noticed that it is
or at least
that would mean that. There is no inflection
Sep 23, 2017 (15:54)
is right. I'm embarrassed I missed that.
Sep 23, 2017 (15:56)
The connecting vowel is
in the aorist.
Sep 23, 2017 (17:45)
Indeed. So my choice would be
for 'he believes they exist'.
Sep 23, 2017 (17:51)
I think it's probable that the unquoted word 'to trust (a person)' is actually
BOR. This way
are perfectly understandable. The Etym entry does not exactly contradict this, it is just more compact; otherwise
(with a long vowel) becomes a peculiar example of a verbal derivation from something totally non-verbal. And
as 'trustworthy' is a super-straightforward interpretation.
Sep 23, 2017 (17:51)
The sentence in question is Túro nyanyarra tenna savisset. Túro keeps telling tales until he believes them. Correct?
Sep 23, 2017 (17:56)
? I would say
(only the core component repeats). And
, as the subject's here).
Sep 23, 2017 (17:59)
I used tyatyamba as a guide for nyanyarra.
Sep 24, 2017 (17:11)
Túro nanyarra tenna savis i nyarnaryar naiti
('T. keeps telling until he believes that his tales [are] true')?
Sep 24, 2017 (17:15)
Yes, that may have a more clear meaning.
Sep 30, 2017 (04:07)
would "keeps telling himself" be *nyanyarraxe since there is a subject?
Sep 30, 2017 (09:42)
in my mind, the
suffix is for actions that are inherently reflexive, like washes himself, combed her (own) hair, - in this regard akin to the Russian suffix
or Polish enclitic
. For other situations like yours I would use
and its inflected variants, i.e.
But I may be sorely mistaken and Tolkien may have intended both constructs to have the same meaning (immo is later than -xe)
Oct 01, 2017 (17:47)
My guess is that
is possible only when the reflexive is the direct object of the verb. In "tell himself sth" it's the indirect object (= "tell sth to himself") and thus would require a dative or allative of
as Tamas suggests.