G+ LoME Archive
Jan Sorondil Slaný
Jun 18, 2017 (02:54)
Hi! I'm very new to all of this, and I am trying to work on translating Gandalf's quote, "all we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given to us." So far is have "Illi lwe harya na uvie na mana na car yo I lume yar na ve." Am I close? Help!
Jun 18, 2017 (04:12)
Don't worry about being new, we all have to start sometime. You are also picking some rather difficult phrases to start with.
You have a lot of the right bits, but they are not necessarily strung together correctly. The first thing to understand about Quenya is that pronominal subject (like "we") are attached to the verb as suffixes (such as
). So "we have" would be
as a verb means "have" in the sense of "to possess", so doesn't really fit what you are trying to say. You really want "have to" in the sense of "must do". I've seen the sense "must" in Quenya expressed with the verb
"to impel", but in this case I think the verb
= "can, be able" is closer to the correct sentiment. I would also use the verb
"choose" instead of the noun
= "We can (are able to) choose..."
"all", I would use the adverb
"only", which is less ambiguous. The verb
"to make, do, act" is a good fit, when combined with the conjunction
polelve rie cile manen care
= "We can only choose how to act..."
means "together with", as in "I went to the store with John". You want something more like the preposition
, I think, or perhaps the instrumental.
polelve rie cile manen care le i lúme
= "We can only choose how to act with the time..."
This passive construction "is given to us" is also tricky. I think the least ambiguous way to do it is to use the passive participle
"given". Also, it is more natural Quenya to use an the indirect (dative) object
instead of the prepositional
polelve rie cile manen care le i lúme ya na antaina ven
= "We can only choose how to act with the time that is given to us"
I think that's reasonably close to the Gandalf's original sentiment.
Jun 18, 2017 (09:20)
one small comment : the correct conjugation would be
Jun 18, 2017 (12:53)
Oh yes, duh, thank you. I am not sure what I was thinking.
Jun 18, 2017 (21:28)
Instead of "how to act" manen care, what to do would be? Mana care?
Jun 18, 2017 (21:44)
Also, would it not be carina instead of care?
Jun 18, 2017 (23:28)
You are correct, "what to do" would be
, which might work just as well as
, that's the passive participle of
with a meaning like "done, made, built". It is an adjective. In this case the infinitive
"to do, to act" fits better.
Jun 20, 2017 (02:36)
Gotcha! Thank you for the help! I think I'm slowly picking it up
Jun 20, 2017 (11:25)
there is also carna as participle of car-, right?
Jun 20, 2017 (12:33)
indeed, but as far as I can see it is only attested as part of
eldamo.org - Eldamo : Quenya : alacarna
(and the EQ
). This does not invalidate it necessarily though.
Jan Sorondil Slaný
Jun 24, 2017 (00:22)
care le i lúme
("do with the time") , how about saying
care i lúmessë
("do in the time")? In my opinion, that still fits the intended meaning well.
Jun 24, 2017 (01:00)
Jan Sorondil Slaný
Sure that works. I'd also suggest the instrumental as a possibility:
care i lúmenen
"do by means of the time".
Jun 24, 2017 (13:58)
I'd prefer the instrumental, but just because I like the way it makes look words :)
Hey, I know that, but I'm kinda a vinquenya speaker, even if I gotta admit I need to updated my knowledge on the topic. Do you have any suggestions on where I can find some good and new material on Quenya grammar?
Jun 24, 2017 (14:45)
I don't know of any recent material (except for reading through the last 5 Parma Eldalamberon issues). But I am in the process of writing one - will be done in a few months I guess.